Disney has been in the news recently for firing its Orlando-based IT staff, replacing them with H-1B workers primarily from India, and making severance payments to those displaced workers dependent on the outgoing workers training their foreign replacements. I regret not jumping on this story earlier because I heard about it back in March, but an IT friend in Orlando (not from Disney) said it was old news so I didn’t follow-up. Well now I am following with what will eventually be three columns not just about this particular event but what it says about the U.S. computer industry, which is not good.
First we need some context for this Disney event — context that has not been provided in any of the accounts I have read so far. What we’re observing is a multi-step process.
Disney had its IT operation in-house, then hired IBM to take it over with the usual transfer of employees followed by layoffs as IBM cut costs to make a bigger profit. Ultimately Disney fired IBM, hired (or re-hired) a new IT staff, which is the group now replaced by H-1Bs employed by an Indian company essentially offering the same services that were earlier provided by IBM. This more detailed story means, for one thing, that the workers being replaced by H-1Bs have for the most part worked for Disney for less than three years.
So the image of some graybeard, now without a job, who had been working for Disney since the days of punched cards simply isn’t accurate. It probably also explains to some extent the Disney severance offer of 10 percent of each worker’s annual salary, which may well have been more than workers with so little seniority might have expected. It’s possible Disney was being generous.
But Disney was also being stupid. This is shown in part by their tone-deaf response to the story, which they clearly weren’t expecting or prepared for.
Some of this comes down to the difference between labor and people. Disney may have been trying to reduce labor costs but did so by dumping people. Journalists and readers get that, some executives and most economists don’t. These aren’t just numbers.
But in Disney’s specific case there’s another underlying issue that has to be taken into account, which is IT mis-management on an epic scale. I have been talking with IT folks I trust from Orlando — both former Disney workers and others just familiar with the local tech scene — and the picture of Disney IT that emerges is terrible. Disney turned to IBM not so much to save money as to save IT. But as you can guess, an essentially un-managed IBM contract was viewed by Armonk as a blank check. Disney started complaining, but it is my understanding that at least some of the trouble had to do with Disney’s own communication problems — problems that didn’t improve once IBM was fired.
“I remember there was a big crisis,” recalled a former IBMer who worked on the Disney account. “There was a massive backlog of new service requests, hundreds. It turned out most of the service requests had already been processed and had been waiting on Disney for months, sometimes over a year, for approval. In the interim Disney had changed their request process. So we moved the finished requests to the new system. A few months later most of those requests were still awaiting Disney’s approval.”
What we’re likely to see in Orlando, then, is a cycle. Unless Disney cleans house — really cleans house — at the management level we’ll see more contractors coming and going.
I blame Disney CEO Bob Iger for not knowing what’s happening at his own company, which I’m told now thinks that moving everything to the cloud is the answer. It isn’t. And with Disney such an iconic brand I’m quite sure there are technical people in Russia, China, North Korea and elsewhere who know very well the company’s vulnerability.
Bean counters in charge of all aspects of a company.
What could go wrong?
Wow! The bean counters have taken over at Disney. How did that happen? Let’s see…
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Scenario 1 – The bean counters all got together, rushed up to the executive suite, and kidnapped all the top executives. The executives are locked up in the boardroom and the bean counters are giving all the orders. Boy that sounds pretty far-fetched to me. Let’s try again…
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Scenario 2 – The top executives have all swapped their MBA training for the operating procedures espoused by the bean counters. So now, the top executives have been transformed into virtual bean counters. No, that still sounds too crazy to be true. One more time…
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Scenario 3 – The top executives asked the bean counters to come up with a plan to cut expenses. The executives weren’t concerned about how this uncontrolled cost cutting would affect the various operations of the company. Yes, this sounds more like what might have happened. But why are we blaming the bean counters for this disaster? We should be blaming the idiot executives that implemented this policy, shouldn’t we?
Idiot executives?
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Executives manage for their OWN bonuses. Second priority are the disney core businesses – theme parks, movie studios, etc. Dead last priority is corporate IT, most of which has nothing to do with the core business and could simply disappear. Sorry if that doesn’t work out for you, but it sure does for them.
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When a good executive see chaos, he gives subordinates a reasonable time to fix things. If that doesn’t work he fires everyone and starts over. Your job is not an entitlement. If you suck at it you should be replaced. Most of the IT people I’ve seen over a 25 year career are at best mediocre.
Re: “If that doesn’t work he fires everyone and starts over.” That’s why they’re idiots. Starting over with cheaper alternatives can cause more chaos. Working with a bonus in mind could be a good thing, but not throwing out the baby with the bath water.
I take it your not an executive.
Napoleon: “There are no bad soldiers, just bad generals.”
Japanese companies provide jobs for life, when the Great Recession came along, NONE of the Japanese automobile companies went bankrupt, but 2/3rds of the American companies did. Ford avoided this fate by going through massive borrowing, including mortgaging the Ford oval marquee, just before the collapse hit.
Re: Napoleon: “There are no bad soldiers, just bad generals.” That’s my point, it makes no sense to take the attitude “If that doesn’t work he fires everyone and starts over”. I’m not criticizing all executives, after all, Gates and Jobs were executives.
Bob-
Your depiction of the displaced Disney cast members is not entirely accurate. I know several who had been with the company in excess of 15 years and were let go. They were not new hires, but experienced staff. However your assessment that Disney has been mismanaging IT is no surprise. The CIO’s office has a revolving door, and there’s a very clear disconnect between the way the senior levels of management try to run things and the way they need to be run. Disney continues to view IT not a as core competency but as an expense to be minimized. They haven’t yet figured out that their primary concern should be serving their customers (the other business units) not the finance people. Screw up IT, and pretty much everything at Walt Disney World stops.
“Disney continues to view IT not a as core competency but as an expense to be minimized.”
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I believe you described almost all medium-large corporations. I’d also throw in security and “the cloud” as well, but I’m sure that’ll blow up once some enterprising hackers finish dealing with the Feds.
‘… continues to view IT not a as core competency but as an expense to be minimized.’ I recently retired from the IT wars after more than 30 years and I can say without a doubt that this viewpoint has been endemic as long as I can remember, and probably going back to the development of the Babbage Engine. Until upper management *really* views IT as something other than a periodic requisite trip to the metaphorical dentist’s office, these sorts of slow motion train wrecks will continue to go on.
Dear Mr. Iger,
My family has been considering visiting either the Disney theme park or touring India. Since you have recently hired Indian H1-B’s, could we get a tour of your IT department and their living quarters when we visit Orlando?
Sincerely,
Dave Wesely
P.S. Will your rides be safe?
Endemic of our race to the bottom, but a great bottom line.
I read that Cringely is going to extend this to an essay on IT in general, but at this stage it strikes me more as just a matter of executives in entertainment misunderstanding IT more than IT itself at fault. Sony is the same, given the extent of the damage done by the hack. Entertainment execs (I agree with a comment above) don’t understand the degree to which IT is central to ALL aspects of the system, not just finance.
It also doesn’t help that this situation is happening in Orlando while Iger himself has a much stronger focus on L.A. (the studios, and imagineering) and New York (ABC, ESPN) and so generally relies on the Orlando execs to take care of themselves. As such, I don’t want to directly blame Iger as he probably was unaware of it other than some exec representing Orlando’s system said “hey, I think I can shave off X percent of my budget”. After the initial purge of dead properties such as the sports teams, several shows, trimming back down the animation dept, and a few other of Eisner’s excessive purchases, he personally was more interested in the efforts to increase revenue and brand cohesion more than the efforts to cut costs within the divisions that were left, particularly in that he was already plotting to *increase* costs for the parks, with the DCA refurbishment and the WDW expansions. He left cost-cutting to his underlings.
So yeah, one could blame Iger for not seeing this as the faux pax that it was and is, but then again, I almost don’t think he even knew it was happening, given his perspective and focus on the revenue and branding side of the empire he now runs. Wall Street generally only cares about cost-cutting in outfits where revenues are down. If revenues are solid and increasing (and Disney clearly is doing that, even with the Tomorrowland and Lone Ranger flops), Wall Street doesn’t notice cost-cutting efforts to the same intent and stock-price effect.
Seriously, Disney World attendance is at an all time high and growing, in spite of Unversal (and in fact, because of it – everybody i know who goes to Universal for Harry Potter still spends time at Disney they might not have otherwise bothered to). There was no reason to do such a cost-cutting exercise at the IT down there other than a typical exec doing that sort of thing out of sheer habit because that’s the kind of thing that execs do.
Iger may not be interested in “cost,” but he almost certainly is interested in “contribution margin.” It’s likely that Bob Chapek, Chairman of Disney Parks and Resorts, was well aware of what could be done to EBITDA by outsourcing IT. In fact, I’d be willing to bet that the business case was dependent upon it.
The specifics of how Chapek was going to meet or exceed his EBITDA target probably didn’t rise above a bullet point in a manager review slide to Iger (along the lines of “We will leverage efficiencies of ‘X’ from Purchasing, IT, …”). Frankly, I’d be surprised if Iger even asked a single question about it.
EBITDA is so last decade. No one focuses on it anymore because it’s such a garbage metric. Anyone who does is clearly a fool.
WOT?
“EBITDA is essentially net income with interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortization added back to it, and can be used to analyze and compare profitability between companies and industries because it eliminates the effects of financing and accounting decisions.” https://www.investopedia.com/terms/e/ebitda.asp What should be focused on instead?
Iger just happens to be one of the co-chairs of “Partnership for a New American Economy”, a bipartisan group whose mission statement seems to be pretty noble: to make an “economic case for streamlining, modernizing, and rationalizing our immigration system.” Partnership Principle #2 is “Develop a simple and secure system for employers to verify employment eligibility and hold businesses that are not compliant, or abuse visa programs, accountable for their actions”. See https://www.renewoureconomy.org/about/
So either the guy has no clue what is going on in his own corporation, or he’s a hypocrite, or “Partnership for A New American Economy” is code for outsource the whole country.
Based on subsequent posts by “Another Jim” and “Irony” it sounds like offshoring IT is common everywhere and in spite of the original terms of the IBM contract, Disney couldn’t stop IBM from hiring H1Bs. So this organization may be an attempt to prevent their contractors from outsourcing “abusively”. Of course, one way to avoid “abuse” would be to reword the H1B laws, modifying the part about favoring Americans, to favoring them only if they don’t increase the cost.
Yeah… I wonder what Michio Kaku (the inventor of string-theory) says about H-1B torpedoes now?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qty1xqvQBrA We need H1B workers in science and tech since the US educational system is producing a generation of dummies. (I’m only paraphrasing his remarks, not necessarily agreeing with them.)
Testing has shown that Chinese in the US do better than Chinese in China, Japanese in the US do better than students in Japan, Koreans, etc. The only exceptions to score better are Finland and Shanghai.
India did not participate, but definitely the US would have come out on top of that as well.
Ah, but I bet those groups didn’t use only the public schools in the US. Oh, wait, those countries use private after school paid instruction far, far more than we do in addition to public school. Huh, I guess I totally agree with you!
Then I guess he should have said “US educational system is producing a generation of [American] dummies”.
Regarding “for the most part worked for Disney less than three years”:
If the outsourcing (and subsequent insourcing some years later) worked as I’ve seen it, I’d bet that some of those affected employees were Disney to begin with, and then were hired on by IBM (in rare cases seconded out to IBM from Disney, but unlikely), and then after Disney took its IT back, these people were brought along, still in their same jobs as before, back to being Disney employees. And then finally laid off. So actually, they could have been employed in the same spot for a lot of years, only with different employers. Heck, I’ve seen many cases where it was policy to transfer seniority and pre-existing benefits (e.g. vacation accrual) from the old employer to the new one, unchanged.
This is nothing new. What Disney is doing the majority of US companies have been doing for a decade. I’ve been working in IT for 25 years and gave up working as a full time employee. There is absolutely no job security in that industry, and anyone who thinks there may be is clearly delusional. It’s not a matter of IF you will be replaced or outsources, it’s a matter of WHEN. This has been the IT industry since high-speed broadband because widely available and affordable.
I now own my own IT contracting company and am making money hand over fist. There are hundreds of contracting gigs out there because of this new industry model. IT is now viewed as a utility, not a service. You should fully expect this trend to continue as the XaaS (Everything as a Service) movement matures. In-house data centers will move into cloud solutions, and those support folks will be out of a job. There is no going back.
My recommendation to IT workers is to start your own support business. The work isn’t going away, but the in-house support model is a thing of yesteryear. Contracting gigs are abundant, and at least mentally you know that you’re there temporarily and view it for what it is: a job, not a career. Your business will be your career, and I think most folks will fare much better that way.
1. Republicans love everything about H1Bs, outsourcing, etc., obviously.
2. Democrats come to Silicon Valley for $.
3. Democrats abandon working people and embrace H1-Bs, outsourcing, etc.
As a user/consumer of Disney’s IT services (websites mostly for bookings, etc.) my personal opinion is that they’re delivering a horrible product that’s out of line with Disney’s resort and park offerings which IMO are quite good. As another commentor wrote, that says that leadership is really out of touch with this aspect of their business. I find it odd that they have that large of a blind spot.
Being very close to this story your comment is extremely accurate. It begs explanation why if other parts of the organization which are more closely aligned to the core business appear to do so well and IT, one of the larger and customer visible staff/support functions, has failed so visibly.
At great risk, I’ll hypothesize that your comment that “you find it odd” was actually not an accident due to so-called executive incompetence or lack of knowledge, but is intentional and deliberate. Do you remember the IBM-McKinsey study on the park in 2005 where vendors were asked via interviews?
The Royal Bank of Canada tried the same thing two years ago:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/rbc-replaces-canadian-staff-with-foreign-workers-1.1315008
They got so much pushback they had to change their plans:
https://www.thestar.com/business/2013/04/11/rbc_chief_issues_open_letter_apology_to_canadians_over_outsourcing.html
https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/05/24/rbc-foreign-workers-hire-canadians_n_3332240.html
I work for another company that booted their experienced IT staff and brought in HCL (the company Disney chose) a couple years back. It has been a complete and total disaster. Thinking that bunch of useless bozos will straighten out your company’s IT problems is like thinking “This bucket of gasoline will put that fire right out!”
Good luck, Disney… you’re gonna need it!
Isn’t this also fraud. I understood the point of the H1B to be to obtain technical talent abroad that is not available here. But this totally public layoff (including having the former employees train their replacements) shows that to be a complete lie.
Bob said “H-1Bs employed by an Indian company essentially offering the same services that were earlier provided by IBM”. So it sounds like Disney first fired their own staff, replacing them with an IBM contract. From Disney’s point of view, H1B was not involved, that was all on IBM. Later they swapped the company they contracted with from IBM to the Indian one. Now it’s all on the Indian company. So it looks like Disney never directly hired any H1B workers. They just contracted with two companies who (apparently legally) hire H1B workers. If the workers are incompetent, then Disney was defrauded by their contractor. But, as with any contract, it was written in such a way that the contractor merely has to show up and do something. It may be hard to prove fraud.
Nonetheless, notwitstanding Disney’s “appears legal” extra layer of going thru a contractor instead of directly hiring their own employeres, it still doesn’t negate the fact that Eric’s point IS correct…..H1B visas are intended to allow outsourced “foreigner” talent to be imported into the U.S. and employed by a U.S. firm only when they perform a specific skill/ability for which U.S. citizens are not available to be hired FIRST who can perform that same skill.
There’s already been a bit of controversy and rumblings in the media, and within various branches of federal government, that H1B program is being abused by corporations in favor of their bottom line, to the detrimnent of the American worker and our unemployment rate.
Thus, I think an egregious move like this is gonna backfire on Disney. If the media gets a bug up their a$$ about this and starts sqawking about it (HEADLINE: “U.S. workers laid off and forced to train their own foreign immigrant replacements who entered using visa program intended only for those ALREADY possesing skills not available in U.S. labor market!”), you can believe that Congress is gonna get all riled up.
I believe Congress has already expressed concerns about large corporate abuse of the H1B program. Just let our unermployment rate go up another point or two and Disney’s gonna be a very convenient “evil corporation who doesn’t care about the American worker” scapegoat. I think Disney’s setting themselves up for a humongous PR disaster.
Imagine a documentary about H1iB visa program’s deterimental effect on the U.S. worker, prominently featuring Disney? It’ll be just like the “Blackfish” documentary about SeaWorld….with the same effect!
Disney’s defense of their actions may be their support of “Partnership for a New American Economy” as pointed out by “NoTalentHack” previously. Outsourcing IT is common despite the wording of the H1B law, so something must be done to enforce the law or change it. See posts by “Another Jim” and “Irony”.
Disney owns ABC and ESPN. So is this IT responsible for espn.com as well? They should have enough IT capability to handle everything they need.
IBM are failing to deliver on projects in a large Australian bank after the recent purge. Lots of GD resources from Malaysia (the new India, sorry Bangalore). The local project managers are not allowed (discouraged) to report that issues with resourcing is a risk or are causing delays but still get kicked by execs.
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Most of the on-shore IBM resources were guns, they are now more Nerf than Winchester.
At the very large, very IT-dependent corporation where I once worked, the management layer above me was told that they would be held directly responsible (in a “shoot the messenger” kind of way) if the corporation’s new and ill-conceived outsourcing arrangement didn’t work out. It was no surprise when, some months later, I was on a conference call with several of my peers and our manager, where he was being told about all of the outrageous and otherwise avoidable outsourcing-related problems that we were experiencing by then. He promised that he would duly relay these very serious issues to upper management.
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I didn’t log out of the conference call number when it was over, and it so happens that the next conference on that particular number was between my boss and his peers and THEIR bosses. As they were being asked about project statuses, everyone (my boss included) duly reported that everything was going along quite smoothly! (I guess nobody was willing to take a bullet that day.) So we’d told the unvarnished truth to our bosses, who then told lies to their bosses, who’d already made it very clear that they didn’t want to hear the truth anyway.
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This charade couldn’t hold up for long, and eventually my boss and several others at his level were replaced by managers from the outsourcing company. (I guess those folks had to lay the finger of blame for their failures somewhere, and had no doubt promised that things would go along much better if they were just put in charge of projects.) And of course the situation quickly went from bad to worse, and then to just plain God-awful!
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Today that corporation is fighting bankruptcy – not very successfully, I might add. Who knew?
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10% of base salary is about 5 weeks pay. That’s pretty bad,something you’d expect of a firm in desperate financial trouble. Given its Disney its reprehensible.
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Yes, IT employees are an endangered species. What business is missing is this fad to offshore and/or contract out IT is very bad for business.
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Go back and look at Bob’s column on Best Buy. While Best Buy had a 1000+ IT department in Minneapolis, they only had a handful of actual IT employees. THEY HAD NO ONE WORKING FOR THE COMPANY. The contractors did what they were told, told Best Buy what they wanted to hear, and tried to sell Best Buy stuff. No one was telling Best Buy what they needed to hear. No one was guiding their IT systems to be ready for market changes.
Best Buy complains bitterly about Amazon. But the truth is part of Amazon’s success was due to Best Buy’s poor plans and execution. Or as John Walker said: “One of the largest unappreciated factors in Autodesk’s success has been the poor strategy and half-hearted, incompetent execution that characterized most of our competitors in the past.: Amazon could say the same thing about Best Buy. I still never walk into a Best Buy store. Prices too high, don;t have what I need, …
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The other reason business has to be very careful about jobbing out IT is TEAMWORK. When there is a problem it takes teamwork to fix it. The more scattered and dysfunctional the team the longer it takes to work the problem. If that problem is a cyber attack, the delays and lack of teamwork can be fatal. For a good example of that, revisit the stories on the Target cyber theft. They had a good intrusion detection system. It worked and it alerted the security team there was a problem. The security team was in India. The command center was in Minneapolis. Minneapolis didn’t react to the alert. We’ll probably never know what happened next. In an organization with good teamwork, the security team would have kept pestering others until the threat was taken seriously. Target didn’t wake up until their cards were flooding the black market and the banks started calling.
The problem isn’t the idiot executives, IT contractors or off-shore IT workers, or even the lowly bean counters. The problem is human nature. Because of the primitive origins of human nature (think of cave dwellers during an ice age), human nature has yet to adapt to modern times. So for example, each social or expertise group considers themselves to be better than any other social or expertise group. It takes a superb leader to get everyone cooperating and working toward a common goal in those circumstances.
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The only person that comes to my mind is General Eisenhower. And he had the incentives of a global war to bring people together. Plus, I’m sure he made many mistakes along the way. So can poor Disney pull a miracle out of the hat with respect to their IT needs? The history of past business failures doesn’t seem to favor it. After all, IT appears to be just an expense to most top execs who came up from sales or finances.
Whew!
I was a little worried when I read the headline of this article. It seemed like Cringely was going to write something that did not involve bashing IBM.
You can only imagine my relief when I got to paragraph 3 and all my fears just flew out the window.
Thanks for making me sweat, Bob!
Bob,
Great article as always. But man I’m so depressed now. I’m still employed in IT (for now), but wonder what the future holds. At this rate, anyone with a desk job is going to be out of luck by the end of the decade.
This isn’t an advice column, but can you share your thoughts on what an average Joe like me can do to survive. I keep hearing one solution is to become an entrepreneur. Not sure I’m smart enough for that. Don’t need to be rich, just want to hang on to being “middle class” as long as we can.
[…] https://www.cringely.com/2015/06/12/disneys-it-troubles-go-beyond-h-ibs/ […]
Just for the record. I was a Disney employee on the ABC account for 26 years and was rebadged to an IBM’er for 5 years. When Disney fired IBM after 5 years we were replaced by an Indian company with the name of HCL. The same company the H-1B’s are under in Orlando. So Disney out sourcing to India has been going on for over 2 years but now they hit the mother ship so it becomes a big deal. And I thought I was unlucky being and IBM’er. Its just IT everywhere. Its a day to day survival
I didn’t pay attention to this because IT outsourcing to offshore hasn’t been newsworthy since at least the early 00s. I think most IT shops have gone through this. It’s an old story. If Disney’s internal IT management is a mess that is indeed a story, but not a story about offshoring IT work. Offshoring is IT standard practice at every major corporation.
The true irony here is that when IBM first got the Disney contract, the contract explicitly stated that IBM was not allowed to staff with any foreign workers. All personnel on the Disney contract were to be U.S. citizens.
https://www.computerworld.com/article/2934978/it-outsourcing/in-a-turnabout-disney-abc-tv-cancels-plans-to-outsource-it-jobs.html?phint=idg_eid%3Dc7f844ff95cf26f78e603d4b463d0e41#tk.CTWNLE_nlt_dailyam_2015-06-12
Seems Disney got scared feet. Its just temporary I am sure
I would love to see how much, if any, attendance has been affected by this. I doubt they have noticed a difference.
I went to WDW the past two years (only trips ever) and absolutely adored the experience — *everything* about it.
I felt like what my family and I got out of it was worth the price. I was hooked, man.
After finding out about the H-1B nonsense, it has totally lost its appeal to me. Maybe, if I wasn’t an IT guy, it wouldn’t have angered me so much. At any rate, I often wonder what Walt would say about it.
As far as people saying that H-1Bs have been used by the corporate world for years, yeah, maybe so, but it seems to be rarely worth the trouble it causes for the money it supposedly saves. As always, the people making the decision to hire cheap coders don’t have to untangle Repunzel’s hair, uh, I mean code.
As someone who has been to WDW almost every year for the past 25 years or so (my parents used to live near Orlando, and we visited them often), I can tell you that it has definitely had its ups and downs over the years. Lately the visible effects of “money men” running Disney have really started to irk me (I pay attention to such things; I will spare you the details so as not to ruin the illusion), but in some areas at least things have maybe started getting a little bit better now. However, overall I’ve generally lost a lot of my enthusiasm for the place.
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The press has been noticing some things, too, with several articles lately about ticket pricing issues and the IT situation. My gut tells me that Disney’s reliance on a “attendance keeps going up no matter how much we raise ticket prices” policy is going to blow up in their faces soon enough. I don’t really put much faith in their attendance figures anyway, because they’ve already let it slip that a lot of their “record attendance” is based on people using annual passes and older (less expensive) extended tickets and such, which don’t really generate much in the way of new ticket revenue. (Repeat visitors also tend to not generate as much revenue in the food and souvenir departments, either.) So Disney is now revamping those to the point where they aren’t nearly as cost effective as they once were, and I expect that the effect on attendance will be quite noticeable.
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Hmm… Sort of an ominous statement about hackers elsewhere sensing vulnerability. That implies a Sony-like hack is awaiting, publishing all Disney movies for free on YouTube?
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Well I heard it here first.
H1-B is irrelevant. If they shut it down tomorrow, these employers would simply move the JOBS
to offshore – so the US/Western workers are still disadvantaged by their employers.
They think that they need to cut (labour) costs to keep their business. They’d be better off investing in better tools and processes for their employees…
[…] Robert X. Cringely, published on June 12. […]
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I’m looking fowrard to The Odd Life of Timothy Green most, but Brave looks interesting and I love their anime type movies, so The Secret World of Arrietty seems good too. I think my siblings would love these ones. 🙂