My last column was about Eric Schmidt losing his CEO job at Google and how that company’s failed bid for GroupOn may have been a factor in Schmidt’s demise. Weep not for Eric, who lasted in the CEO position for 10 years and earned $5.6 billion, which puts every other U.S. CEO to shame, even Steve Jobs. It’s interesting to consider Schmidt’s career arc and how he got where he is (isn’t?) today.
Eric Schmidt started his post-academic work life at Sun Microsystems where he loved all the smart people but was ultimately frustrated by management that he felt was simply not as smart as he. Remember Scott McNealy was in charge of Sun when Schmidt left and McNealy rightly admitted that Sun’s 1990s server ascendancy with the Internet bubble was a happy accident as was Java.
Schmidt moved-on to Novell, another company filled with smart people but also a company in crisis or they never would have considered a non-Mormon for CEO. There he slammed into a culture with completely different values, one where he was ineffectual because as an outsider he simply never got it. Schmidt came away from Novell determined that the best way to find a suitable culture for his brilliance was by building it himself.
When Andy Bechtolscheim introduced Eric to Google co-founders Larry Page and Sergy Brin, Eric quickly saw this as his chance to create another Sun from scratch with himself as CEO while avoiding the entrenched cultural problems he had faced at Novell because almost everyone would be a new-hire. That was 24,000 Google employees ago, so what we see in Google today is definitely a reflection of Schmidt — an intellectually curious but not especially passionate outfit.
I believe it is this lack of passion that ultimately came to hurt Schmidt at Google.
Is this likely to change with Larry Page as CEO? I think it will a bit. Page is more passionate than Schmidt. His view is less stratospheric and he allows himself to be a little more vulnerable. But this very vulnerability will be his downfall because most of what he does isn’t likely to succeed and that will tell on Page very quickly.
How long again did Jerry Yang last as CEO of Yahoo?
Now to GroupOn, which recently spurned a reported $6 billion buy-out bid from Google. I posed the idea in my last column that $6 billion was too much for GroupOn as a company that seems to have no proprietary (and therefore protectable) technology and a lot of emerging direct competitors.
Then I read this week an excellent paper by the very clever Ahmadali Arabshahi that analyzes the GroupOn business model showing why be believes it is such a perfect fit for Google. Remember my point wasn’t that the merger was a bad fit, just that it was too expensive and Google should instead build it’s own GroupOn-type service I called GoogleOn, which they now appear to be in the very process of doing.
Ahmadali sees synergy for Google with GroupOn’s Chicago-based sales force. But he sees even greater potential in what Ahmadali calls “price discovery” — Google’s ability to use what it knows about our consumer behavior right down to MAC addresses and gmail content to individually price each daily offer so the optimal number of us accept its terms. Remember that’s the basis of a GroupOn — a substantial discount on some local good or service offered for only one day and to be paid for up-front.
The weak spot in GroupOn’s business model, as Ahmadali notes, is that it is hard to scale a single offer per market if you aren’t selling exactly what that market wants at exactly the price it is willing to pay. He thinks the algorithm jockeys of Google could optimize GroupOn and make it even more of a commercial juggernaut.
Against this my friend Ed Kohler from Minnesota raises some very well-informed concerns. The GroupOn sales force may be over-rated, Ed thinks, but more importantly the GroupOn deals aren’t even as good as can be found on sites like restaurants.com.
I didn’t know that, did you?
Add to this the fact that a small percentage of GroupOns are paid-for but never redeemed (the company and its partners surely count on this for substantial extra profit) that GroupOn risks alienating we normally docile consumers. We may be stupid but eventually we catch-on and GroupOn, having turned-down Google’s $6 billion, might shortly fade as just another Internet fad.
I come down somewhere in the middle of this argument, less concerned about either Google or GroupOn and more concerned about, frankly, me. This is an old story. I wrote a column years ago at pbs.org arguing that pages like this could be easily paid for not by advertising but by readers throwing coins in an electronic tip jar. The very next week PayPal invented PayPal Donate to solve this problem (I still have the e-mail from PayPal thanking me for the idea) but PBS would never let me use it. Time to start thinking again.
I believe there’s a logical extension of the GroupOn business model to almost any affinity group, an example of which could be the readers of this rag. What if I eliminated ads entirely and replaced them with a quarterly chance to buy something at a huge volume discount? It would have to be something most of us would like to have and the discount would have to be very real (you tell me what that would be).
If a few thousand of us were captivated by the offer this space could be easily sustained ad-free. It’s an idea I have toyed with in many forms for the last couple years. Not long ago I came up with the idea for a new form-factor PC I thought could serve as the first offer. I’d sell them under the CringeCo label, I thought, though they’d be made, like everything else, somewhere in Asia.
Alas what I thought I’d invented was essentially an iPad. I had a couple advantages but not enough to really compete, so the offer never happened. Yet the business model I think could still be a success for mid-size web pages like mine.
Let a thousand GroupOns grow.
Good idea. Then how about dinner with the nice looking person at the top of this post? Didn’t you meet Mrs. Cringley that way (you were the dinner prize for a PBS donation)?
What he didn’t tell us, the second place prize was two dinners with Bob.
You know another model for groupon is to become a kind of tax reduction scheme, in the same way you don’t have to pay taxes on amazon.com purchases out of state, which makes buying things on amazon.com worthwhile.
Groupon coupons could become a kind of barter currency. I think barter transactions are taxable, but is it the same for coupons? Businesses could mint coupons for each other, in effect bartering without incurring tax. There is the added benefit the coupons are transferable and can be traded after minting as well. Coupons could even be bundled and traded in the same way mortgage backed securities were . . . well let’s not go there.
But you get the idea . . . coupons are a license to print a kind of money – money backed by the real goods offered behind the coupon, which anchors the coupon value. But once the coupon is minted it takes on a life of it’s own and it can behave exactly as ordinary money does.
Exchanging products is barter … so is the exchange of coupons backed by products. Exchanging services is also bartering, so exchanging coupons backed by services would be barter. So, exchanging a coupon backed by a product or a service for a coupon backed by a product or service is a taxable exchange.
Nice try, but no dice.
Didn’t Eric Schmidt work for Xerox Parc at around the same time Apple was trolling for cool tech? Any chance Eric Schmidt may be headed to Apple?
Great insight. Considering Jobs’ current (and potentially ongoing) absence, Schmidt could well be the only person capable of running Apple.
No dice. Israel and Palestine get along better than Jobs and Schmidt.
http://cultofmac.cultofmaccom.netdna-cdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/schmidtjobs.jpg
Better stick to that ads
…the ads
Even if the discount scheme worked, why pass on the ad revenue (which your tech-savvy readers probably don’t even see in the first place)?
In fact, if the discount scheme worked, why exactly would it need your articles to fly?
And last, just how many ideas on the order of the CringelyPad do you think you can ship each quarter? To be honest, I don’t think you could get enough of us to agree on lunch much less buying something every quarter.
Still, you never know without giving it a go…
Sorry to burst your bubble but this space **is** ad free – on Google Reader
or AdBlock Plus. why doesn’t everyone use it?
Yeah, I had to take a look at it in Chrome to see what ads were here. Had completely forgotten about them with AdBlock Plus
I installed Adblock a very long time ago, but I forget why.
Could someone explain please, what are these “Ads” of which you speak?
One approach would be to apply what AppSumo (https://www.appsumo.com) is doing (offering a bundle of software and services at an excellent price) to your site. They’re currently offering a Mac developer-oriented bundle; they’ve previous offered bundles that would appeal to gamers, startups, etc.
Bundles targeted to the interests of your readers could generate revenue that you could use to decrease or eliminate advertising.
Get us a discount on the “teach your parrot to talk” books you were pimping before and you have yourself a deal!
Awesome 😉
I remember that. Slick.
This is an interesting take on GroupOn:
http://biznik.com/articles/a-groupon-tale-the-parable-of-the-cobbler
I’d buy one of your remote controlled buggies. I’d pay more if you laser engraved my name on it and sent it to the moon.
I’d buy one of your baby monitors.
I’d buy a boxed set of Nerd TV 2.0. I’d even pay a bit more if a) there was no actual box (going green here) and b) I got to see it 3 or 4 weeks before general release.
My biggest problem with GroupOn was that it was all useless crap. I don’t go to Spa’s I don’t eat out very often or buy new appliances every single day. What I need is to reduce my grocery bill or buy more insulation for the attic. USEFUL things. GroupOn/SocialLiving/GoogleOn are just rampant consumerism.
vote up! vote up!
Cringe said, “I wrote a column years ago at pbs.org arguing that pages like this could be easily paid for not by advertising but by readers throwing coins in an electronic tip jar. The very next week PayPal invented PayPal Donate to solve this problem (I still have the e-mail from PayPal thanking me for the idea)…”
I remember that article. It’s at the end of the following link, right? https://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/2001/pulpit_20010531_000420.html
If that’s so, then I’m the one that’s responsible for giving you the idea that resulted in the PayPal “donate” button. I never realised.
Anyhow, if I have any more bright ideas, I’ll be sure to let you know. I’m not finding the “coupon” angle particularly inspiring, but that may be just lack of vision on my part.
Get us health insurance!!!!
A practical item like… TIRES might be attractive.
Set up a deal with a national distributor like the TireRack.
When you get one thousand buyers, execute the discount / coupon and let the seller pay you. Then there is relatively little bookkeeping from your end, just verification that your one thousand customers actually buy during the time window.
Eventually, your reputation and repeat business might grow into something worthwhile.
What’s wrong with ads, Bob? I actually find a site like yours – great content with a reasonable selection of not annoying ads – to be a pleasure to use. I do almost feel bad that google reader strips them out since it deprives you of the ad impressions. Do you dislike using ads to generate your revenue? Or is it something youre concerned about for your audience?
Also, I think a subscription model could work great. Let me subscribe to you for $0.99 a month or week or whatever and give me something extra – like respond to emails I send or send me a piece of content you create that you don’t post ti the blog, etc.
I like what LWN.net does. They withold certain articles for a couple of weeks, during which only the paying subscribers can read them. Then they open them for everybody.
It’s just an idea. Not sure that it would work out for you. After all, most of the magic of this blog is making assessments or predictions at the right time. If most of the readers miss out, the effect is lost.
“build it’s own GroupOn-type service” should be:
“build its own GroupOn-type service”.
Oh, crap! Do you HAVE to correct grammar?
That’s not as embarrassing as “GroupOn risks alienating we … consumers.” Him needs a third-grade refresher on pronouns.
[…] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Matt Snitchler, Samuel's Feed. Samuel's Feed said: Getting my GroupOn: My last column was about Eric Schmidt losing his CEO job at Google and how that company’s fa… http://bit.ly/f4TlKC […]
Yes, the parrot article was good.
The only thing that everyone will agree on is pizza.
No anchovies
I DISAGREE!! I love pizza with anchovies … and I know I am not the only one.
Sorry, Bob. You’re doomed; we can’t even agree on pizza.
Am I missing something here? I don’t see any ads and I have no “anti advertising” software at all.
I just turned off my “hosts file blocking” to see. There are 3 banner ads on this page: one at the top of the column, and two on the right side. Supposedly, the included list of 3rd party ad servers blocked are just those that use “tracking”. I imagine tracking has become so common that the list is quite large. If Bob served the ads via his own site like ads.cringely.com they would not be included in the list unless you added the server to your own copy of the HOSTS file.
I use a polipo proxy server and I give it the both the easy adblock list and the hosts file list from mvps. I know, this deprives websites of a much needed funding source, but my pages load faster and are less annoying. The tip jar idea would be better.
— I know, this deprives websites of a much needed funding source
Seems a non sequitor, to me. Anyone who takes the effort to install ABP wouldn’t click on ads in the first place. Sites lose nothing, since there wouldn’t have been any traffic from ABP users in the first place.
Well some of the payment models for ads are per impression, not per click. If you use a hosts file, or polipo with a forbidden list, the ad is never fetched, so the impression count is lower.
Didn’t know any ads were other than click payable any more. Who would pay that way? It was that payment model from print/radio/tv that the web click model was offered as superior. Adverts have largely abandoned those venues, as we all know. But that fact also makes the likes of Google vulnerable, since anything which generates more/better clicks will blow it out of the water; advert buyers will flee in a New York Minute. Making “search” better isn’t the issue; killing off (which requires finding it first) that better application before it can get a toe hold is the issue.
One of the sites I have have worked on has an interesting approach to Ad Block Plus: if you don’t take the ad, you don’t get the content injected into the page.
I have no inside info on either, but it seems to me that Page is no Yang. And I don’t think the word you want is passion, you probably mean vision. Steve Jobs has a vision of where he wants computing to go, as flawed and closed as that vision may be, but the Google guys seem to just throw stuff at the wall and hope something sticks. That experimentation is not a bad strategy but at some point you have to learn from or derive conclusions from your experiments and I don’t think they have. As for applying the GroupOn offer model to online publishing, it strikes me as another in a long line of dumb content monetization ideas, from ads to job boards. You had the solution almost a decade ago, micropayments, as did Jakob Nielsen in ’98, Bob Metcalfe in ’95, and of course the term was coined by Ted Nelson in the ’60s. It’s a huge joke that we still don’t have a working system 20 years into the rise of the internet, which speaks to the fundamental ignorance of the techies that could implement it. The arrival of micropayments will spark another tech boom, except sustained by real revenues this time, just you watch. 🙂
So let’s see,
1) You were smarter than Google. They shouldn’t have tried to buy Groupon.
2) You were smarter than PayPal and invented PayPal Donate.
3) You plan to invent Beezid after it was already invented.
4) You invented the iPad.
Why are you writing a blog? Shouldn’t you be a billionaire? Or are you delusional?
In 1990, while a Major Account Manager at Xerox Ventura Software, I wrote a white paper wherein I described an adaptation of Xerox Ventura Publisher which would be a view and print only adjunct product to be given away free with every copy of the full creation version of the product, and which would incorporate a new concept called “hyperlinks” to be used on corporate intranets as the initial target market.
Yep, I was among the first to describe the Web Browser and the Netscape distribution model. If I had been able to convince my senior management to listen to me (a lowly middle manager) the future at Xerox might have taken a different direction, and I might be living in Singapore or Costa Rica instead of Central Connecticut.
Great ideas are not enough; the ability to capitalize and sell the idea is probably more important.
Wouldn’t you agree, R.X.C.?
I know we have bantered about “short of shutting down the internet” in previous blog comments here on Cringely. Interestingly, Iran couldn’t do it during their riots (apparently Twitter was heavily used by the protesters), but Egypt can today. Apparently is done by targeting both DNS and the Border Gateway Protocol, with more than 9 out of 10 ISPs offline.
From this graph it’s a lot better than 90% effective.
https://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/01/egypt-isp-shutdown/
s/build it’s own/build its own/
I don’t find the ads on this site particularly intrusive.
Please ease up on the (intrusive) hyphens! (or should I say “please ease-up on the hyphens”)
e.g.
moved-on => moved on
paid-for => paid for
catch-on => catch on
Sure, how about a great deal on metal foil drives and x-prize lunar rovers?
Hmm, I wrote a comment last week that appears to be caught in your spam filter, apparently because I had the bravado to use more than one link in my comment. Any chance that can be let through?
Your suggestion sounds sort of like affiliate marketing. I see it all the time on the info products blogs, like ittybiz.com.
If you sell copies of the “How to feed your Parrot” book from your blog, there is a cut for you and some to the publisher.
Are you looking for the “like Google ad words and GroupOn” combined startup to aggregate and sell the affiliate links for your blog? Startups that are described as a combination of two successful companies usually fail.
[…] losing his job, Mr. Schmidt’s history, and an analysis of Google’s failed bid for Groupon. Bob always has the details the rest of the tech columnists […]
I would happily send a few flattrs (http://flattr.com) your way if you had a button.
Groupon Clone is really hot business today influenced by the success of Groupon. My friend tried his own business in the mode of Groupon Clone, and has been successful, he got the technology from the company Joomabc . It is a terrific experience.
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Google does not have our MAC addresses. IP addresses, yes, but you change that by requesting a new one from your DHCP server.
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